More Details About Disclosure

4 Oct

The two most shocking things from disclosure concerned his bachelor party and his history with chat rooms and anonymous sexual partners.  I am still processing some things from the bachelor party and waiting on the answer to a few questions that he was unsure of (mostly concerning the timeline, when the plan was made to do what happened, and who was involving in the planning).  His best man came to me well in advance of his bachelor party, and ask me what would make me feel comfortable and what was off-limits.  I asked that the party not entail strippers or live, naked women of any kind (you have to be specific sometimes with that bunch).   My husband was also adamant about that before-hand.  I say this to clarify that I didn’t have to volunteer the information that I didn’t want strippers – I was asked about what would make me comfortable, then promised that my feelings would be respected.

It turns out there were strippers involved with his bachelor party, complete with multiple lap dances and naked lady parts all over my soon-to-be husband.  There was a trip to the “back room.”  He said he wasn’t aware of what was going to happen until after the got there and had already been drinking.  By that point he wasn’t able (willing, whatever word you want to use) to say no.  He said if he knew ahead of time he wouldn’t even have gone to the party.  Not going at all and putting his foot down in advance would have been easier for him than saying no face-to-face with the peer pressure of his friends, especially once he was already drunk and high.  He didn’t have the balls to say no because he didn’t want to look “pussy whipped.”  Gag!

I believe him that he didn’t know in advance, but I am so incredibly hurt that he didn’t stand up for me, for himself, for the promise he made to me, for our soon-to-be marriage.  I am very hurt about all of the lies he told me afterwards, all the way up to 2 days ago.  I feel sick thinking about it.  I also get flashes of anger.  We had talked about strip clubs extensively.  He had lied to me about going to strip clubs on several occasions in the past, so it wasn’t a secret in any way, shape, or form that I already felt betrayed by him in regard to strippers.

A month or so before his bachelor party we also had a HUGE blow-up incident because he was blatantly checking out another woman at a bar in front of me in a very disrespectful way.  The wedding almost didn’t happen because of that, and we had a very long, very emotional conversation about my boundaries.  I told him then that I feel disrespected and devalued when he does those things, and I will not accept that in my relationship.  I can say with absolute certainty that I wouldn’t have married him if I was aware of what happened that night.  We aren’t in the past, though.  I think I can move beyond that now.  I am upset, though.  I don’t know what to do.

However, I would really like to know whether his best man lied to my face to give me a false sense of security, or whether the planning was done by someone else and materialized after that conversation.  That distinction is very important to me.  It doesn’t make a difference in my marriage, but it does make a difference regarding his best man, who has recently made a re-entry into our lives on a very regular basis.

He didn’t owe me anything, really – my husband was the one who made commitments and promises to me that I had the right to trust in.  Still, I always thought he was a friend of our relationship – one of Mr. Mess’s only decent friends (there is only one other friend of his that I have felt close and safe with besides his best man).  It’s possible that he didn’t plan things to go the way they did.

The best man’s younger brother has been a constant thorn in the side of our relationship since the beginning.  He was the one “responsible for” the strippers.  I have no illusions about him, and wouldn’t trust a single word that ever came out of his mouth.  He is Bad News in every way I can think of – alcoholic, drug addict, sex addict, immature, pushy, an overall bully, and someone who hasn’t had a real relationship or commitment to another person in his adult life (except for a married stripper that he was dating for a bit).

I didn’t think his best man was like that, though.  I always thought he had more integrity than his brother.  He has been married for ages, and he always struck me as an upstanding, honest person.  He is the only person who could have convinced me that my boundaries were going to be respected.  His word to me before the bachelor party is the only reason I have held onto a shred of hope that what my husband told me happened (or didn’t happen) was the truth.  At this moment I don’t know how much he knew about the strippers or when.  If he lied to my face to make me feel safe while planning all along to disregard what we talked about, I don’t know how I will react.  It may also ruin a new sport that I have grown to love.

I am trying not to live in “what ifs.”  I am trying to put my feelings in perspective.  I am trying to reconcile whether he can still be a part of our lives – whether I should let it go until or unless another situation comes up where I would have to trust him or his integrity.  I am trying to figure out why that betrayal hurts worse than anything else I heard.  I am trying, trying, trying to wrap my brain around this.  I think I will post an article later that really resonated with me on this topic.

As for the other information… I discovered my husband has been visiting chat rooms for the purpose of having sexual encounters since the invention of the internet (basically).  I also discovered that he has slept with somewhere in the ballpark of 50 women off of those chat rooms (he isn’t certain of the number).  That activity – sex chatting, phone sex, pictures, then finally culminating in an in-person encounter – was a constant pattern in his life, happening at least 2-3 times per year.  When he had slept with one woman he ignored her from that point forward and the cycle repeated itself.   That happened four times during our relationship.

After revealing his random sex partners off of the internet over the course of almost 20 years, he said that he “always” used protection with them. Later I asked what sexual activities they engaged in (just the basics, no details). When he mentioned oral and anal sex, I had to ask again… So you always used a condom with all sexual contact? He said yes. Then I clarified a third time – including oral and anal? Suddenly, the story changed, and he realized that NO, he in fact did NOT use protection every time.  He only concerned himself with condoms for vaginal sex, even though STDs can also be transmitted through other sexual contact.

In that circumstance, I needed to ask those questions to feel safe. I don’t know how long some sexually transmitted diseases can stay dormant or which ones he could be a carrier of without recent symptoms.  I do know that he hasn’t been tested since 2003, and I have never been.  That makes me worried, especially because his last sex hookup off of a chat room was 6 months before we met.  So that question was one I needed to be triple sure of.

So far, those have been the two areas of his disclosure where I asked for more details than he provided (for the most part, with the exception of basic clarification).  I really have to make the distinction – what will help me heal and what will keep me stagnant? What do I NEED to know, and what will keep me from moving forward?

There will be plenty of other details that I won’t be asking. There will be many things I don’t want to know.  There may be things that come up that I realize are important.  We shall see.  For now, I’m looking forward to getting a resolution on those few things, and to talking to the MC in an individual session tomorrow.

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12 Responses to “More Details About Disclosure”

  1. emily January 8, 2013 at 5:05 am #

    Chat room pick ups ended six months before he met you?????

    you believed him????

    • beautifulmess7 January 8, 2013 at 7:12 am #

      Oh, no. The chatroom pickups didn’t end then. Just the physically meeting them in person. Or so he said. As for whether I believed him…? Not wholeheartedly. I always had my doubts, especially about one particular woman. Thankfully now I don’t have to worry about it because he’s not in my life anymore.

  2. Our Journey After His Affair October 4, 2012 at 4:47 pm #

    As for the friend, I had to deal with a similar issue. One of Mike’s band members – the drummer, who he talked with frequently – was someone Mike confided in. He told him about our problems (in his misleading truth) and let him know that he was searching for other women. This guy – “L” – and his girlfriend wound up trying to hook him up with a girl. They even brought her to their first show after getting back together. (Which was on this day last year, I believe) He denies doing anything with her and I believe him because she took her home while I was still there. But then I think maybe she meant to the house they practice in. I don’t know. The girl was handicapped and confined to a wheelchair, so having sex with her would’ve been an arduous process. But she couldn’t performed oral sex on him. This is the one incident I’ve been struggling with lately. I wish I could afford a polygraph so we could just get everything out of the way. I want to believe my husband, but it’s hard to believe that he had an opportunity to “get some” and didn’t go for it when that was what he was seeking. Maybe he had enough dignity to not use a crippled girl.

    I don’t know. The thought of him doing that makes me sick, so I understand how you feel when you think about the things you know that he revealed. When I found out that L and his girlfriend had tried to hook Mike up, I sent them both a nasty PM on Facebook and cut them out of my life. I made Mike do the same. Shortly after that, L and I had a long talk over FB about the situation. He apologized for getting involved and expressed that Mike has told him how much he regrets his decisions and how much he does love me and wants this to work. Maybe you could give this guy the opportunity to do the same then base your decision on that?

    I invited L back into my life, then shortly after I removed him again because he was just a passive asshole.

    And it sounds like both of you need to get tested for STDs. I made Mike do it after D-day.

    • beautifulmess7 October 4, 2012 at 6:51 pm #

      On your last comment – that is definitely happening. Tomorrow, in fact.

      As for the situation with his best man… I’m still not sure how I feel. I hope my therapy session tomorrow can help. He actually doesn’t have a Facebook account or even a cell phone, which could be a good thing – I guess. It means that I will either have to call him at home or talk to him face to face about this issue.

      My husband is going to try to reach him tonight on his way to or from school, but I don’t know if that will be sucessful. On the one hand, I want my husband to face this uncomfortable situation that he put us in. On the other hand, I feel like I might need to discuss this with him. I’m not looking forward to that awkward and potentially emotional conversation. I would much rather avoid him, but that probably isn’t the healthiest option.

      What makes things more complicated there is that he is my karate instructor. I am supposed to go tomorrow night for a karate class. I have fallen in love with it. I also think he is a great instructor. Tomorrow is probably not the time to talk to him, especially because there are many people in the class, including kids. I don’t want to skip out on it without at least letting him know I won’t be there, I don’t want to go without talking to him, but I also don’t want to talk to him before class with my emotions running high then potentially have to leave as others are getting there… Uggghh!

      My mother suggested an alternative solution, which is to try to let it go and just not put myself in a situation where I have to rely on his word. She suggested that my husband will have to consider whether he is a “safe friend” – someone he can trust to encourage him to do the right thing – or a person he can’t have a deep friendship with anymore. That may be the best solution. I just don’t know.

      I also want to say that I’m sorry you are triggering. I know how emotional those “antiversary days” are. I don’t know how much the polygraph will cost at this point, but unless it’s astronomical I think the investment in my sanity is worth it.

      • Our Journey After His Affair October 4, 2012 at 7:26 pm #

        I agree with your mom. It is also a sane solution. You don’t have to invest anything into that part of your recovery…your husband does. I made Mike get the STD testing because I wanted him to go through the humiliating experience. If anything came out of it, or if I started having symptoms of something, then I would go. So far, so good. His came back negative!

        But yes, I 100% agree with your mom….don’t make things any more complicated for yourself. Let him deal with it. He can process their discussion with you once it’s over.

        I plan to write a post soon going over everything in detail. I’ve had to take these past few days to simmer down and really think things through. I had to determine exactly why I was feeling the way I was and thinking the thoughts I had. I didn’t want to dismiss it as simply triggering and my behavior was the result of that. There was so much more to it. The triggers really escalated things, but one of Wayward’s posts was kind of the catalyst for it all. I don’t blame him for anything…it was an amazing post, it just made me really think back on what happened after D-day.

        I survived the PTC today without turning into a mess. 🙂

  3. Our Journey After His Affair October 4, 2012 at 1:33 pm #

    Not sure why your posts aren’t popping up in my reader, but I just saw this one in my email.

    I just painted my nails, so I’ll respond later.

    • beautifulmess7 October 4, 2012 at 3:14 pm #

      Thanks. Looking forward to your thoughts.

      P.S. – What color? I just did my toenails a cute pink called “Back to the Fuscia” 🙂

      • Our Journey After His Affair October 4, 2012 at 4:34 pm #

        Haha!! That’s a cute name.

        They are a shimmery gold color (Bling Dynasty) with two black accent nails. Very Fall-ish/Halloween-ish.

  4. Castimonia October 4, 2012 at 11:31 am #

    If I am rigorously honest about my own “bachelor party” I wanted to have strippers involved and willingly acted out with them. I can’t place the blame on my best man or others simply because I knew what I was getting into. In your husband’s case, he may not known what was going on. I willingly walked into the strip club. If your husband’s bachelor party was held elsewhere (say somebody’s house, a regular bar, etc..) then I can see where he may not have been able to stop it after it started.

    I have lost many friends since I entered recovery – mainly because they were toxic relationships that still supported the addiction and acting out. However, I have gained better, greater, deeper relationships than before. I used to lament this because my best man knew both sides of me, the addict and the human. It wasn’t until I read my first step to my group and became close friends with them with whom I have a deeper, intimate connection.

    I think one thing left to ask (if not already asked) would be if he had any same sex sexual partners. For many men in recovery, it is extremely shameful to hold on to those encounters and will continue to plague them throughout their recovery. Same sex includes men, transvestites, transsexuals, etc… Not all of them go that far, but the disease is progressive and escalates. An addict continues seeking the more perverse, trying to get that “next, better” high from the addiction.

    The next items would be children, animals, incest, or unwanted pregnancies not disclosed. I’ve been to enough meetings to have heard it all. I am not saying your husband did any of the last 4, but if he did, and is still holding on to those issues, then he needs to let them go.

    • beautifulmess7 October 4, 2012 at 11:38 am #

      Don’t worry… I did ask all of that. It will make me feel better to get double confirmation through the polygraph, but in my gut I believe his answers.

      And about the strippers… I completely agree with everything you said. He went. It started at someone’s house, but they drive to that club. He walked through those doors. He accepted those lap dances. He can’t blame anyone else.

      One reason I want the polygraph now is for confirmation that nothing else happened that night beyond the lap dances – that there were no “back room activities.” I don’t think I could handle if that happened just a week before we got married.

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  1. His “Rules” About Cheating « Being a Beautiful Mess - October 8, 2012

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